Junction Triangle Boys' & Girls' Club controversy
September 13, 2010 - 2:58pm — vic
Please use this forum to discuss the cancellation of the Junction Triangle Boys' and Girls' Club project on Ernest Ave.
(Note: Discussions started off-topic in another forum, and I am moving the messages here)
Thank You Tony Puopolo
Last night I enjoyed dinner with Tony Puopolo, the retired Executive Director of the Dovercourt Boys and Girls Club. We were joined by a former member of the Club's Board of Directors to say thanks again for everything and congratulate him. After a two year battle, Tony just won a court settlement against the Dovercourt Boys and Girls Club for non-payment of portions of his retirement package.
The total waste of time and other people’s money and just the sheer mean-spiritedness of the Club is another example of the appalling behavior of this organization and members of its Board. As we have experienced before, it took a big stick and legal intervention to get the Dovercourt Boys and Girls Club to do the right thing and honour their commitments.
So congrats to Tony. Many of you will know we only have a Boys and Girls Club (in large part) because of Tony Puopolo. He has been through a challenging and completely unjust ordeal. I’m certain he left dinner knowing he still has lots of friends in the neighbourhood and not everyone living in the Junction Triangle supports or condones the bully-style management of this public service organization dedicated (some days) to serving children in the area.
Thankyou
Thankyou Tony , It was fun growing up at the Club, I never did believe all the crap they were saying, and really disappointed in management, (directors).
it's absolute power corrupts absolutely.
late 50's, 60's and 70's were great years....
Howard Glaze, Lou, Nick, etc....
Joe V.
Not a Day to Celebrate
The Junction Triangle Boys and Girls Club is holding an open house tonight at their new location on Bloor Street. While the Club is sure to tout how great this is for the neighbourhood, the truth is something less rosy.
Operated by the Dovercourt Boys and Girls Club, this organization has badly managed their affairs and setback social services and programs for children in our neighbourhood by at least a decade.
When the lease ran out on their original location on Randolph, the Club had no where to go and moved into temporary facilities. A new location was found a year later on Ernest Avenue, but after a year of renovations and tens of thousands of dollars, the Club abandoned the facility without ever opening the doors. The total loss is close to $300,000.
The exit from Ernest was based on a number of falsehoods that the Club has never explained or apologized for. While telling the neighbourhood they couldn't afford the location, the Club spent close to two million dollars building a second floor on their Westmoreland clubhouse that already had a gym, swimming pool, computer lab, games room and a library.
As a result of the gross mismanagement of the Junction Triangle situation, the City of Toronto placed conditions on the Club when they were granted the use of the below-market-rent location on Bloor Street that now serves as their new clubhouse. None of those conditions have been met - hire a new Executive Director by September 1, include more JT residents on their board, develop a plan to build a new clubhouse that meets or exceeds their original location and start communicating with the neighbourhood at large.
The organization continues to think that the neighbourhood should support their efforts without any accountability. So now the City is investigating again what measures should be taken to ensure the Dovercourt Boys and Girls Club meets their obligations. It is a sad state of affairs and not a day to celebrate a location that is one-third the size of its original location and a fraction of the size of the Westmoreland clubhouse that is so clearly their priority.
New exec director at Boys & Girls Club
"It was recently announced that Danny Anckle will assume the role of executive director effective Oct. 17. Anckle boasts more than two decades of experience serving youth and has served as a volunteer on several boards."
Article in The Villager / Inside Toronto here:
http://www.insidetoronto.com/news/local/article/1224721--boys-and-girls-...
House-Cleaning at Dovercourt Boys and Girls Club
September brought some welcome (and much needed) change to the Dovercourt Boys and Girls Club. Board Chairperson Vivian Payne has been replaced. Operations Manager Justin Hanna is no longer with the Club.
In mid-October, a new Executive Director will become the senior manager at Dovercourt. According to the hype, Danny Anckle brings more than 20 years experience and a great deal of energy to the job. Let's hope his efforts are successful in turning the Club around in the Junction Triangle.
The previous administration badly bungled the new clubhouse location on Ernest Avenue resulting in the loss of more than $300,000. They shrunk the Junction Triangle Clubhouse from 7000 sq. feet to something close to 2800 sq. feet. It is disheartening to hear them tout the new location as a great success.
The hiring of a new Executive Director is one of four conditions the City of Toronto has imposed on the Dovercourt Boys and and Girls Club as a direct result of the Ernest Avenue Clubhouse fiasco. The other conditions have not yet been met; the Club has failed to recruit additional representatives from our neighbourhood on the Board of Directors, they have had no communication with our neighbourhood and eventually will have to deal with finding a new, more suitable location for their operations here.
At this point, I just want to say thank you to everyone who signed on to the letter to the Ombudsman and voiced their concerns about the Club. It helped a lot! The Dovercourt Boys and Girls Club is not out of the woods yet, but the prospect of new management provides a glimmer of hope for the future.
Progress to date
As a concerned community member, I was curious to know where these issues are at today. Obviously a lot of bad things have been said by both sides (Vivian not acting very 'spokesperson-ly' and others attacking her or DBGC in general). But where do things stand as of today? Is the JT not getting a clubhouse still, is the DBGC being investigated (as seems to be insinuated by the last posts in late February), what are they being investigated for, etc.
I'd really like to know. Thanks for replying in advance.
City Department Now Investigating Dovercourt Boys and Girls Club
Citing jurisdictional issues and its role as an office of last resort, the office of the Ombudsman of the City of Toronto stated this afternoon that it cannot investigate the Dovercourt Boys and Girls Club and the Junction Triangle clubhouse situation. The Ombudsman's office stated that neighbourhood concerns need to be addressed by agencies funding the Club first. Failing resolution of those concerns, then they can be approached again for re-consideration.
Following the Ombudsman's advice, the City of Toronto Department of "Community Funding Programs" has been contacted. A formal complaint about the situation in the Junction Triangle has been filed and an investigation is now underway at this City department. It will not be a fast process and no one should expect a quick response, but the wheels appear to be turning.
Disappointed you included Marjolein name
Disappointed you guys included Marjolein Winterink to the list of JT residents letter to the Ombudsman. First of all she doesn't live in the area and two you guys been so adamant to find out the truth about the B&G Club on Ernest. We don't know what involvement the late councillor (Adam Giambrone office) had with the boys and girls club???
Those who were at the All Canadidates debate heard Kevin Beaulieu take credit for the Boys and Girls Club on Ernest Ave. What credit was he taking and what was there involvement with the B&G if any, we don't know that???
I phoned the permits department and spoke with an Adam staff 416-392-7539, unfortunately he was not able to give me to much info on the permit, but what I understand the permit is still open???
How can you have a proper investigation when you guys keep protecting the councillors office(adam giambrone) you don't do that with Tony MPP or Mario MP. JF
Dovercourt Boys and Girls Club
The letter to the Ombudsman is something that I welcome. The answer to it should provide an end to this conflict. And then can we all get on with providing services for children?
Why Wait for the Ombudsman?
Interesting that the Board Chair of the Dovercourt Boys and Girls Club seems to thinks everyone should wait on the Ombudsman for the "answer." If there was any legitimacy to the Club's claims, they would simply produce the documents showing that 45 Ernest Avenue was in non-compliance with City zoning regulations. They could settle the matter by providing the legal opinion saying it was a good strategy to vacate the premises at 45 Ernest without notice. They could also put an end to the "conflict" by showing why they continue to characterize the landlord's rent deal that provided 45 Ernest at cost as "sky high" and part of some "gravy train" that the Board Chair is going to tell the Mayor she stopped.
I'm sure the Ombudsman will be as interested as we are to see this material. Let's hope the Dovercourt Boys and Girls Club doesn't keep her waiting as long as residents in the Junction Triangle have been.
DCBGC Still Hiding
I am glad that the Chair of the Dovercourt Boys and Girls Club welcomes being dragged into the Ombudsman's office but its a shame that people had to go to the Ombudsman in the first place and it says everything you need to know about governance at the DBGC. More and more Junction Triangle is deciding that somebody new with strong local governance should start offering wider and more accountable services to children AND teenagers in this community. Its time that we looked after ourselves.
I will be very interested in how the Ombudsman feels about hundreds of thousands of dollars being pissed away with ZERO accountability and ZERO community participation. Cant wait for anybody with courage at DBGC to stand up in front of the JT community and justify that. Cant wait.
Lets be Hard on Issues and Soft on People
In general we might find there to be some wisdom in conducting ourselves in a manner conducive to building positive feelings about our community. The way we express ourselves when we disagree with each other is a critical element of our discussions. We want to feel free to express our opinions openly, we also want to avoid being unnecessarily hurtful of each other personally. There is a balance to be struck but lets keep in mind the idea of setting the bar a little higher when it comes to naming and objecting to an individual. I would want to see a strong justification for this kind of thing.
In this case I see no justification at all. I have seen Marjolein at several community meetings in the Junction Triangle on several different topics, I think she was at the architecture thing a few weeks ago. So clearly her interest in the community is not simply professional. I don't think it is healthy to fixate on where people live, or how long they have lived here. If a person makes themselves part of our community, we should make them feel welcome and loved. If we ever got to a point where 'community' events had a majority of people from outside our area, we might want to understand why. But we don't, and it is best for us to focus on problems that are manifest.
The rest of your note seems to suggest you imagine Adam's office had some nefarious connection to the problems with the Boys and Girls club. I don't see evidence, but lets entertain the idea for a moment. If Marjolein was involved in any way with anything inappropriate, it would be contrary to her interest to call for an investigation. It is not clear to me what you think is going on, but a clear connection to Marjolein that would justify a personal attack is absent.
Fundamentally Marjolein is supporting other community members in calling for an investigation. She is being supportive of the community.
Therefore I feel it would be appropriate for you to apologize to Marjolein for objecting to her participation in our community.
Good Post
That is an excellent response Warren and it moves discussion back where it belongs which is an investigation into the Dovercourt Boys and Girls Club and their governance and financials. That is what the issue is and those who care about the delivery of services to children in our area will stick to the topic at hand. Anything else is unhelpful.
If you read my last post it did say- If any
Warren you and others are obviously bias so no-matter what I say will make a difference. The difference with you and some others and you know who you are, not just in the JT but across ward18 regardless if Adam office did something wrong it would not matter, because you wouldn't admit to it anyway. The other difference with me and others is I don't have any bias against our elected officals( politicians) for Davenport because I called all 3 out when they did something wrong. So please spare me the drama.
You failed to mention in the letter that Marjolein was working for ex- Councillor Adam Giambrone office and not only that she was a former board member living near the DB&G. Lastly I won't apologize to Marjolein for saying she does not live in the community and I hope that some of you give the same respect to Ana that you have given to Adam.
Not Everything is About Politics!
Jack, could you leave the politics out of anything? This discussion is about children's services in the Junction Triangle. You want to make everything about politics and your strong dislike of the former Councillor. He's gone, get over it. Marjolein's employment status has nothing to do with this discussion of the community effort to get the Dovercourt Boys and Girls Club fiasco resolved. If you can't focus on the issue at hand, please don't blog here.
Calling the Kettle black
Kevin just calling things as I see it, sorry I don't agree on your or your groups one sided ideaology(LEFT). If someone has been a little bit political is you. Having Andrew Cash sing at the park I feel is a little political, what do you call it. Kevin I think you can learn how to be a little bit more open and honest. I have never meet anyone like you and I am sure I am not the only one who thinks this. Calling yourself Allen, Joseph, mother of two and a CBC reporter I find this to been a little misleading. No I don't mind not posting not because of you, because of your little group been so one sided.
Stay on-topic please
This forum is about the Boys and Girls Club controversy. Please stay of topic. If you want to talk about other issues, please create another forum. Further off-topic posts will be deleted.
As for "politics", Jack, again you're commenting on events that you didn't even attend. I don't recall seeing you at any of the picnics in the parks last summer. Though I do recall seeing people from at least the Liberal party (including Mario Silva and Ana Bailao), the NDP, Green Party, and others. I don't recall seeing anyone from the PC/Conservatives, but you never know. Those events were non-partisan events, and if anyone from any political stripe offered to play music, help out, or attend in any other way, they were welcome. It was a common goal.
As for fake names...I've been respecting the privacy of people who post under fake names, but I might put an end to that eventually. The fake names, and accusations of fake names (which are often very wrong) are quite embarrassing. Don't push it....
-vic
Well put and accurate
Well put and accurate. The delivery of accountable and quality services to children, and teenagers, in our community is an important issue that everybody seems to get. Staying focused on the issue at hand serves our young people best.
DBGC Unanswered Questions
The February 8 statement by the Dovercourt Boys and Girls Club is little more than another serving of platitudes and generalities. Swimming lessons, while great on their own, do not make a clubhouse. If clubhouses played no role in the delivery of social services for children, the Dovercourt Boys and Girls Club would be closing their Westmoreland location rather than spending $1.7-million on building a second floor.
No one expects that government money for a dedicated project should be diverted, but the project on Westmoreland also boasts about a substantial fundraising effort called "Through the Roof." Why was no effort made to raise additional funds to save the Ernest Avenue location?
The February 8 statement does not provide any documentation showing that the club was in non-compliance with zoning regulations. Can the Club show us a single document to prove their claim? Where is the legal opinion showing that the Club could vacate the premises based on this assumption?
And finally (for now), why was the rent described by the Operations Manager as "sky high" when the landlord was offering the location at cost? Is it okay to call this local business person greedy and part of a gravy train when nothing could be farther from the truth?
The February 8 document answers none of these questions or even offers an apology for the shameful behavior of the Dovercourt Boys and Girls Club.
An answer
I'll answer your questions Kevin to the fundraiser portion and further comment.
At the time when "Through the Roof" was on, a group of us that formed the Perth Festival Committee for the sole purpose of raising funds for the b/g here.
There was a lot of community involvement around the time that we were fighting for Leon's to not kick the club out and Tony Puopolo was faced with a number of questions from the community.
-Why can we not do a fundraiser for this location?
-According to him, 2 fundraisers could not run at the same time as they would interfere with the "Through the Roof campaign".
One parent asked if we could not have a portion of those funds as this b/g club here was sinking.
-Tony stated "no" due to the fact that the donors were donating for the "Through the Roof" Campaign.
-We/I was told that once that campaign is over, there would be one for this community.
I raised this issue at the Board Meeting (former board) and was told that this community here was going to be looked after next.
I will state that during the crisis of trying to find a b/g location for us, Tony Puopolo stated there was not a budget for rent.
We were looking for a location that was donated or free space for non-profit organizations or a location with a very minimal rent.
He made the decision for Ernest and the former board supported him knowing FULLY well the funds were not there to sustain this building.
We can complain and speculate and finger point but it's not resolving anything.
Changing their name to Junction Club does not take away the fact that this club is and belongs to the Dovercourt B/G regardless of the latest comments from the president of the board. (the current board does not know the history of the club)
The are the outreach program in this community but still the Dovercourt Organization.
I'm not going to defend Justin but...I will say that the original decision for Ernest was not made by him or the current Board and financially this location could not be sustained due to not having a budget in the first place.
The accountability of the events that have taken place up to now lie with the former Executive Director that ran the club for 30-40 years and the former board that agreed with his decisions.
He resigned and following his resignation, the former president of the club resigned immediately after.
This is not hearsay or speculation, this is fact!
Where does this community go from here rather than just making noise on this site?
How can we gather as a group to help these guys out?
Carla
carla.heavenly@gmail.com
Suggestions
"Where does this community go from here rather than just making noise on this site?
How can we gather as a group to help these guys out?"
1. Get our new City Councillor, Ana Bailao, involved. Write letters. Maybe get her to hold a special Town Hall meeting in your area to kick things off
2. See if you can interest the media in an investigative story, suggest contacting Toronto Star, Globe and Mail, if no go contact OPENFILE
3. As a registered Canadian Chairity you can (with a lot of effort) get the feds involved in looking at the books http://www.cra-arc.gc.ca/chrts-gvng/lstngs/menu-eng.html
Getting action is often an uphill climb but persistence will pay off
Troubles at DBGC Point JT In New Direction
While any official communication from DBGC is good, the February 8 letter sheds no light on how this process came so far off the rails in the first place. Nobody at City sees zoning issues, the rent was not "sky high" and it seems hard to believe that in the year of construction nobody spoke up. And when the Board decided to pull the plug they did so with no community input and against the recommendations of the Councillor. Could this space have been saved with community help? We will never know because everything the DBGC has done has been done in secret and it is only after the current outcry do we get any response as unhelpful as it was. The new letter is a positive note in a process that has been non-transparent and has excluded the Junction Triangle Community.
I have yet to see any hard evidence that backs up any of the claims about reasons the Clubhouse was closed.
I feel that the Junction Triangle and respected local businessman Peter Ross deserve an apology.
I find it hard to believe that "no public dollars were invested in the project". This fiasco will cost near to 300,000$ and that money had to come from somewhere. Somebody has to account for it and be held accountable for it.Our children deserve that at least. An audit by the City would help close the credibility gap.
The Junction Triangle is under serviced is many areas besides services for young children and I think the experience with the DBGC shows that the time is now here to move on and consider other more encompassing solutions for community building with a strong local presence in the decision process. I have heard from at least 25 residents with different family needs that they would like to try to salvage the Clubhouse on Ernest or create a new one in the area but something bigger and in a place that could really become the heart of the Junction Triangle Community. There is a great opportunity here to seize the momentum and finally deliver the all services OUR community needs.
Greedy or Generous? You Decide
On September 21 2010 DBGC Manager Justin Hanna was quoted in the Toronto Star as saying that “Sky high rents” were one of the reasons for closing the Ernest location. Obviously there was a rental charge for the location but saying the rent was “sky high” creates the impression that the cost impact was unreasonable and so high that the club had no choice but to close. It creates the impression that a greedy landlord was charging high rents.
A look at real estate listings shows this could not be farther from the truth. In fact the landlord of the property had given the DBGC one of the sweetest rental deals one could ever imagine; far below comparable properties in the area and probably the cheapest rate that the club will ever find. “sky-high” is in fact the best deal that any group could ever hope to get in the JT area.
A survey of of listings was done by Chander Chaddah, a real estate broker who specializes in the west end, shows similar properties on Sterling, Primrose, Keele, and Ernest Avenue (remember that commercial spaces big enough for a clubhouse are few so you have to compare within an area). The results show costs per square foot (including what is called TMI: Taxes, Maintenance, Insurance) starting at around 6$ per square foot and rising as high as the 10 or 11 $ per square foot range plus an annual increase.
How much was the rent at 45 Ernest Avenue? Less than 1$ per square foot! With no annual increase and no TMI costs (utilities were extra and "at cost"). According to Mr. Chaddah, the rate charged was just enough to cover the landlords property taxes and nothing else. Mr. Chaddah notes that this location was previously listed at 10$ a square foot (TMI in) but the landlord reduced the rate 90% for the DCBGC making it one of the cheapest spaces of its kind in the city!
How is this “Sky High” ? Just like “zoning issues” when citizens take a closer look, information supplied by the DBGC doesn’t seem to hold up.
“Operations manager Justin Hanna blamed the sky-high rent for the board’s decision to reverse course.”
http://www.thestar.com/news/gta/article/864497--west-end-youth-club-aban...
sky high rates
geez, i wish my mortgage payments were "sky high". thanks for continuing to ferret out actual facts and information.
Reminder: Please stay on topic
Just a reminder to everyone, please stay on topic. Whenever an issue gets too heated, it is easy to lose the sense of what is being discussed.
This forum is about the closure of a satellite, Junction Triangle, Boys and Girls Club location.
Thank you.
Chill out
Everyone,
Please take a breather here. This is spinning out of control, and except for a few of the posts, we're not really getting anywhere except for accusations and name-calling.
How about if from now on the ONLY time you post to this thread is when you have NEW INFORMATION, or at least some positive suggestions on how to proceed. Back-and-forth bickering isn't really getting much accomplished.
And a reminder again to please abide by this site's Code of Conduct. Be nice, stay on topic, and stick to the facts.
Boys/Girls- LET ME SHED SOME LIGHT
It amazes me that this b/g club issue is still floating around and no one has correct facts.
The children in this community have been IGNORED and neglected for years! This is no novelty except to the new group of parents that have moved in or taken an interest in the community.
Facts.
-Years ago, when the lease expired on their old building (Randolph) ,a group of us parents involved the media, rallied Leons and did everything in our power to aid this club to persuade the previous building owner to renew the lease
- Adam Giambrone was also involved in assisting this club.
At this time, involved parents took the time to go and look at viable venues for this club. The issue at the time was finances.
Lack of finances.
I along with others, organized 2 community festivals to benefit this club by raising funds. Perth Community Festival was born.
The MAIN ISSUE at the time was,
the Executive Director and former board of directors at the Dovercourt B/G Club were not concerned with this location. (Oh they said they were but I was there..)
-Their whole focus was building a 2nd floor at the Dovercourt B/G location and this club was ignored.
Many questions were asked by parents in this community and the media became involved. Search articles (leon's boys/girls)
The question was being asked, "why is this community ignored?"
When I inquired into who governs these non-profit organizations with some of my friends that worked there and the answer is, (feel free to search this) it's up to the executive board.
The NATIONAL BOARD was aware of what was happening with the Randolph location at the time.
-A temporary solution was provided by the former executive director knowing fully well that the finances were not there to sustain this club long term.
-He then QUIT or retired and left the place in shambles.
-The president of the Board quit right after him and several members resigned.
I think this speaks volumes!!! 1+1=2
My suggestion would be that "those interested" in helping spend their time and energy" find out how to open up a legal investigation into the financial matters of this club and where the monies have been allocated over the years instead of arguing here on this site.
The answers lie with the former executive director who will blame it on the board he manipulated.
The answers lie with him along with the lack of paperwork he left behind.
He knew financially they could not sustain this place and the current board is at a loss for what to do so they have no blame.
The new executive director (Justin) was left to pick up the pieces of the mess he left behind.
Their decision to close this location was the only one they could make.
If an actual legal investigation comes out of this, pls. feel free to contact me at carla.heavenly@gmail.com
I have a lot of information which I will gladly happily disclose if a legal case is open and a subpoena issued by a court judge.
language
Can we please refrain from using foul language in this discussion and others? It's precisely the kind of thing that puts people off commenting here, or even reading about what's going on. I think most of us are interested in what's good for the kids and the community, but people have different ideas about what that means. It strikes me that the phrase "i just want what's good for the kids" gets used an awful lot by people who won't even listen to each other. They are so far away from agreeing with each other, that after a while their claims ring a bit hollow.
language ps
The post above, "language," was in response to a post by Jack that has now been removed by the moderator because of foul language; it isn't a response to Carla's post.
Code of Conduct reminder
It's a good time to remind everyone to please read and abide by the Code of Conduct for this website. In this case, please refrain from personal attacks and foul language. We're talking about a kids' club here, and trying to maintain a family-friendly website.
Thanks,
Vic
CORRECTION-Sorry I meant the YMCA
CORRECTION- Sorry All. I meant the YMCA and not the United Way who I spoke to about helping us fund raise and run a facility for us. JF
Why didn't you run for a
Why didn't you run for a position on the board? You could be on it helping to make things better instead of making good people's lives miserable with false and erroneous accusations.
Trust
To address the question directly, the lack of information is an excellent reason. If you consider serving on the board of an organization, it is very important to have a good relationship and be able to trust the other members of the board. Leaving your kids with someone also demands trust. If the boys and girls club need help dealing with their problems, the first step needs to be full disclosure and open communications. Nobody is suggesting this is easy, just ask Michael McCain.
Trusting
Also, if you are going to operate a program using taxpayers dollars the entire city should know about what is going on here. Full disclosure needs to be made to the kids, to the community, to the landlord and to the city. We are speaking about honesty and accountability here. I am still waiting for the letter that was to be sent home in September.
Boys and Girls Club
I am a mother of two children and I am wondering what I am to do to defend their rights. We need to know what is the real problem in order to help to resolve it or at least to find solutions to help our kids to have a place but no just a place a second home where they can develop their skills, where they can waste their energy in order to grow up like any other kid. If we want to have a good future for our young people we have to put our efforts together and fight for their rights. Kindly let us know what the problem is.
Are your kids in the programs
Are your kids in the programs we offer? Call the DBG office, 416- 536-4103. They will help you get your children into programs.
Teens and the Club
I noticed a few teens wondering the streets in the evening a couple of weeks ago. At least one was smoking. The Boys and Girls club promised that the new location was going to reach out to this age group that is already forgotten and have a place for them to go. I agree with Mother of Two that the club would help the kids develop their skills and help them obtain a better future. Don't let these kids fall through the cracks.
Hi
There are no false and erroneous accusations.
I suggest you gather your facts before commenting on things you have no knowledge of which entails who I am and what I have or have not done.
And note...I did not blame the current board, present exec director and/or staff involved as they are not responsible for what lead up to this fiasco.
If there is an investigation and a court order is issued, there are a couple of us willing to step forth and disclose what we were privy to when we served on the board.
Until then....
Really disappointing
It's the kids that lose out in this whole process, and there doesn't seem to be any good solutions for the neighbourhood' needs .
Local Children not the only victims
That's another thing that gets left out in this story. The owner of the property on Ernest is a long time businessman in the area and he put a lot of food on tables in this area. This project was in some ways a chance for him to have a legacy project but instead he ends up with a renter who tries to break a lease for no reason.They basically vacated and he had to go after them! What had he done to be treated so poorly? All he wanted to do was help and there were already other people interested in sharing the space to help cover the rental costs.You have to ask yourself would you sign a future deal with somebody who had a track record of skipping out?
And what about the teenagers from Central Tech who devoted time and energy to getting the Clubhouse ready?
And what about locals who did fundraising or spent time getting other projects to dovetail with the Clubhouse? 2 weeks before the closure they were being told everything was fine.I know, I was one of them.
There are a lot of people owed a proper hearing, explanation, and apology. The longer this festers the more it hurts the reputation of a national organization that has done great work.
I'll answer your concerns as
I'll answer your concerns as best I can, point by point.
1. The permit is part of the landlord/tenant dispute and can't be discussed. Have you ever been part of a legal dispute? Usually, your lawyers tell you to shut up.
2.The Board of Directors does not have any onus upon it to make reports to the general public. It does have an onus to report to Members at the Annual General Meeting. Members at the General Meeting will be welcomed.
3.What does "repleased" mean? Is this a legal term I don't know? If so, I will be happy to address this question in a future communication, after someone explains it to me.
4. As anyone who has been involved in the most minor of legal situations knows, we cannot comment while the situation is up for decision.
5. We are spending money at Westmoreland, Federal stimulus money, a grant. Put simply, if we didn't spend it on our expansion plan at Westmoreland, we'd have had to give it back. All the money for the reno of Westmoreland was accounted for separately. To cancel the reno at Westmoreland would have been to refuse the dedicated funding provided by the Federal government, key word "dedicated". The funding of the Westmoreland reno and the failed Ernest project are two separate issues. The money for Westmoreland could not have been diverted to Ernest. The money for Westmoreland is dedicated funding, meaning it can not be spent in any other way than the grant application dictates.Would it have pleased people in the Perth neighbourhood if we had turned down the money and no renovations would have happened? Or could they be happy that we got it and that we have a Board of Directors who are actively trying to figure out the benefits possible for both ends of the neighbourhood?
6. What do staff have to do with union negotiations? Fundamentally, the writer reveals his/her ignorance of procedures. Contract negotiations are a very formal process. Personalities do not enter into the mix. To imply that personalities were a consideration is to insult both management and workers. From management's viewpoint, the achievement of this Collective Agreement was that there would be some rules and from the worker's viewpoint, the achievement would be that there would be some rules. The DBG policies were lacking in rules and both sides agreed that there should be rules and agreed on rules in the new contract. The contract with LIUNA was a win/win. The employees are better served, and so is the Club.
7. Your last query is simply absurd. I can't make any sense of it. All I can say is that the union did its best for its members. I don't think Manny and Matteo betrayed them in any way during negotiations, if that's what you're thinking. Nor Tony Palermo. Justin was part of the management negotiating team. I have no idea what you are talking about here. So I can't answer you.
I'm posting this around 11:45. Is that acceptable? Or do I deserve some criticism?
boys and girls club discussion
Hello Vivian,
It's good that there is discussion going on, and I can understand why you feel defensive given the tone of some of the comments on the site. I personally don't mind what time you make your posts and I also appreciate your point that you chose to stay involved with the board even when things became difficult. Sometimes it's easier to walk away. That said, you may not realize how your comments sound to us -- defensive, sarcastic and dismissive. Perhaps people on both sides (it's too bad there isn't one side here!) should take a deep breath and remind ourselves we are supposed to be working toward the same goal. How can we make the discussion meaningful and close the rift that has developed? You say you can't discuss the problems with the Ernest location because of ongoing legal issues. But surely you can understand how people in the community feel about how things have ended up so far? Perhaps a more conciliatory approach might get us somewhere....
6 Months and not a peep
Remember that to the time of Vivian's posts the community gets to add 6 months of waiting for information about a process it was left out of. People have waited patiently and with courtesy and now understandably they have have lost faith.
The answer is.
DEEPER PROBLEMS!
Justin Hanna became the Executive Director when Tony Pupolo quit/retired without much notice.
The shambles of the paper work fell on Justin's lap.
Point of clarification -
Point of clarification - Justin Hanna is not the Executive Director of the DBG. He is the Operations Manager, which is the same position he was in before the resignation of the former Executive Director. To repeat, Justin Hanna is the Operations Manager, as he was before.
and ????
Who is the new Executive Director then?
Make BG CLub Zoning Letter Public
I am not exactly sure how you "rush" into getting building permits in the first place. I have not heard of or seen one document from the City that says that the Boys and Girls Club could not use the facility as a much needed Clubhouse that would also help engage the ignored teenagers of the area and maintain existing programs. If this is one of the problems then make the document public; if it exists.
Prove There Was A Zoning Issue
Here are some quotes from DBGC about "zoning issues" which are cited as one of the reasons for the closure of the clubhouse. These are not my words. But nobody, and I mean NOBODY including City, has been able to provide one document that shows that a Clubhouse could not open because of zoning issues. Evidence shows that everybody at City worked hard to interpret the zoning in a favourable way for DBGC which it did and the Board was told this in person before they pulled the plug. So in light of these comments below, provide a document or the name of a person at City who said the DBGC could not operate because of zoning.
1. In a letter to the Community on the DBGC site signed by Justin Hanna:
“This was not an easy decision to make; however, based on a re-evaluation of zoning, permit and other issues associated with this project, we realized we needed to rethink this large endeavor, and assess all options for our permanent space in the Junction Triangle community.”
http://dovercourtkids.com/junction-index.html
2. In the Toronto Star Justin Hanna is quoted: “Operations manager Justin Hanna blamed the sky-high rent for the board’s decision to reverse course. He also said there were zoning issues.”
http://www.thestar.com/news/gta/article/864497--west-end-youth-club-aban...
3. From an open letter that was circulated and posted on the community website:
“The project at 45 Ernest Ave was one that was rushed into by the previous administration, one that was never properly evaluated for its site use requirements, effectiveness or economic feasibility. Our organization rushed into a massive capital project without ensuring that all proper steps, including proper zoning, were taken to ensure that our Club could properly operate in this facility. As a result of prior poor planning and judgment, we would have been left with a centre that could never serve the basic function of our organization, let alone the long term programming goals that staff are planning to execute over the coming months.”
https://www.junctiontriangle.ca/node/855#comment-2278
4. DBGC Chair Vivian Payne also wrote on the community website citing new information that is never explained: “We are just now finalizing our information letter to go out to the community. You are right, we are cancelling the Ernest site, and we are planning a community meeting to explain the situation. It is really complicated, and we do have very good reasons, which will be explained, I promise. At the AGM, there were things that we did not know that affected the viability of the project, hence the optimism about Ernest that you saw at that meeting. That optimism was genuine. We received new information during the summer which, frankly, doomed the project, and put the entire operation of the Dovercourt B & G Club at risk of bankruptcy. “
Hi Scott Dobson Risking being
Hi Scott Dobson
Risking being identified as sarcastic again, since when are zoning permits so cryptic that they have to be "interpreted"? It seemed like pretty plain language to us.Or would you like us to open a professional dance studio? It's not really in our mandate.
Why do you want this lousy location so much anyway? What's your stake in it? And is it really a criticism of yours that we'r bad because we respond appropriately to new information with new strategies? Oh, shame on us for responding appropriately to new information. We will try to do better in the future...but doesn't this mean that we should endeavour to do worse in the future? What do you want?
What do you want with all this? You say it's accountability, but all the records are public and available to you, for fees payable to the various levels of government involved. Are you just too cheap and lazy to do the paperwork? And all records will show that we are telling the truth, meeting our mandate and being responsible.
If you're a parent, you can communicate with the Club daily, and at the AGM. If you're not a parent, you can write letters to the Board of Directors. You can even run for the Board of Directors. There are many ways to connect positively.
The huge fuss you are making seems to me to be always about that you're upset about the feelings of the owner of Ontario Hardwood Lumber and how he is not going to make money. When I meet Rob Ford, and he tells me that he stopped the "gravy train", I am quite likely to give him a high five and say "So did we!" What's your endgame, the destruction of the Club? Where do you see your tactics ending up? That's an important question and you need to answer it.
We are doing the best we can do, and we are doing a damn good job. Programs are running, there are more kids involved than there were last year, the staff is pumped and you just want to whine and whine about how your poor friend, who is upset about his inability to leave "a legacy".
If your friend had truly wanted to leave a legacy for the neighbourhood, he would have renovated the space himself, he would have put in heating for the winter and a/c for the summer, he would have addressed the contaminated ground issue himself, all of which would probably have taken care of the permit issue, and he wouldn't charge more than a nominal rent. We would have named the building after him. We could probably have got the city to name the end of the street after him.
If your friend wanted to leave a legacy in the neighbourhood, he had the opportunity. But I think he thought he was on the gravy train, and we have kicked him off.
1:55 a.m., any criticisms?
Attacking The Messenger Doesnt Work Here
When I piss away 300,000 dollars of donated and public money without any accountability to the community or the taxpayer, then the issue will be me. Attacking the messenger will not get you off the hotplate you are currently on. My "endgame" is accountability by those who created this fiasco. Your cheap shots don't cancel out our right to know. Just a reminder, the issue is not the Junction Triangle Community, it is the Dovercourt Boys and Girls Club.
Hi Joe W The building at
Hi Joe W
The building at Westmoreland is owned by the City, and many of the improvements should be taken up by you with the City Councillor. For example, pool maintenance is a city issue, not a DBG issue. The DBG did not put in the pool. The city put in the pool.
The DBG charter, or mandate, or mission statement, whatever you want to call it, only applies, strictly speaking, to the Dovercourt area and the original bounds. The Perth neighbourhood project is an outreach project of the main organization.
Perth is an outreach project, and is very successful, we would like to expand it. But to be clear to you, there was never an onus upon the DBG to start it, no onus upon the DBG to continue it and there is no onus upon the DBG to build a second clubhouse to house it. It is, and always was, since its inception, a satellite program of what is happening at Westmoreland. It began with a spirit of good will. It is ironic that it is now a point of contention and division.
If the Junction Triangle community would like to establish its own independent Boys' and Girls' Club, with its own clubhouse, and its own funding, the DBG would totally support that and assist them in their efforts. In the meantime, the DBG is happy to do what it can do to provide as many services for children as it can.
You must not be reading all the posts or you would understand about the money for the renovation at Westmoreland. The money for the second floor at Westmoreland is Federal stimulus money and can only go to a defined project. Direct this particular complaint to Mr. Harper. If we could have split the money, we would have.
yes, it's 3 am when I am posting this, but I slept from 8 to 10:30 and got up again, anybody care to comment?
More fact checking to follow
More fact checking to follow. Next up, was the rent at Ernest really "sky-high" compared to other rental properties in the area? I don't think so.
We keep dissecting-The truth is
We keep trying to dissect this B&G club ernest saga, trying to make sense but the truth is and like I mentioned yesterday we had no support or push for a better Club House neither from with in or from the outside. We keep directing our frustration to the Dovercourt Boys and Girls Club, it's not the kids fault out there they needed a place the DB&G Club bas been around a lot longer then any our sites. Which brings me back to the point yesterday, you see Tony Puopolo who was the ED and should of been advocating for us but he wasn't really advocating for the JT club house site like we all thought, it was merely smoke. How do I know , I don't think I mentioned this before but last year or the year before when we were fighting to save the b&g club on Randolph I phoned the Ontarion Chapter and spoke with the Director of the B&G and this really flooored me, when I was speaking to her about the Randolph site and the staff and so on, When I mentioned the good job that Tony Palermo and Nick was doing, she didn't even know who Tony Palermo or Nick was, because all she knew and wanted to know was about Tony Puopolo he was the star for both sites, this man suffered from Napoleon complex and had to be in control.
Now how can you have 60, 80 or 100 kids during the summer been watched by someone/staff and you don't know who they are specially after all the media attention Randolph got, what if something would to happen. Tony Pal was the person in charge or running the daily operation of the Randolph site, yet she didn't know anything about the staff or much about the randolph site or the staff who ran it because all the focus was for the Dovercourt site.
The only way we are going to get a club house is when the B&G National or Ontario people get on board along with with the 3 levels of government, the public sector, community and more importantly you need money if we are ever going to get a club house in the JT.
Where do we all go from here?
I understand your frustrations and yes I can hear resentment in your postings. It feels as though many people are roaring very loudly, the discontent they are feeling regarding the sudden closure of the Ernest site. It closed before anything ever happened.
However, your statement “Your access to my thoughts and opinions and information is now denied by me. You wanted more open contact from the DBG, I was providing it and you killed it.”, is a very dramatic statement indeed. But I took the time to search though this discussion forum and the first comment you posted up was responding to Allen’s lengthy comment (January 19, 2011 - 6:16pm ) and this is what you wrote:
-----------------------------------------
misinformation
January 22, 2011 - 2:13am — vivian
Almost everything in this posting is completely wrong, and what is not completely wrong is only somewhat right.
-----------------------------------------
Our first introduction to you representing the Boys and Girls Club was short, curt and totally lacked any openness of information. That first comment post set the tone to people feeling even more neglected. Moreover, your next two comments posted up on February 1, 2011, were this:
----------------------------------------
The whole point is that he
The whole point is that he doesn't have any actual information, but he's saying it anyway?
Why didn't you run for a
Why didn't you run for a position on the board? You could be on it helping to make things better instead of making good people's lives miserable with false and erroneous accusations.
----------------------------------------
Both those comment postings in response to further questions, were again curt, vague and lacks openness of information. I believe, you too, have set the tone to the online conversation that you now claim is thus “I have participated honestly thinking I was dealing with honest people.”, as per your last comment posting on February 7, 2011.
Where do we all go from here? I don’t know. But frankly, the one main question that would be helpful is, if the BG Club was under NO obligation to keep a satellite location in the JT, it would have been considerate of you, as Chair of the Board of Directors and acting as a community liaison via posting up on this web site, to have given us information on how the community can approach the Club headquarters in initiating a proposal for a permanent location in our neighbourhood.
Where do we all go from here?
he said, she said
While you are feeling badly for Jack, I have to ask, Did you see what Jack wrote about Tony? Probably not, because it was removed by the administrator, who happens to be a really decent, fair-minded person. I don't think you have "politely addressed disagreements" and I also don't think you have given us much "information" so having that access denied now is not losing much. Though it is unfortunate that you never seemed to respond to the more moderate comments here, or to clearly answer questions the community has every right to ask.
What I said about Tony is nothing compared to what he done
Hey Vivian thanks for speaking up for me, but I am okay I don't let things like this get to me or take it serious. The truth of the matter is there are some people who are still in denial about what Tony did and his part in this mess. Some need to find someone to blame instead of moving forward. Like I said to you before Vivian there is a small group of people living within a larger group who think they speak for everyone in the Junction Triangle.
What needs to happen and I mentioned this before since this incident happened in the JT/ward18 a letter needs to go out to the all the residents in this community explaining what the future plans are for the Boys and Girls Club in the JT and an update to what is happening now wtitten in English and 2 or 3 other top languages that are spoken in our community. I already spoken to Ana's office to get involved and be part of this. So this way EVERYONE is aware and informed.
My concern and question is what safe guards are in place so that this will not happen again??
The whole point is that he
The whole point is that he doesn't have any actual information, but he's saying it anyway?
I spent an hour writing a
I spent an hour writing a reply to this post, but it disappeared suddenly. I'll try again. I have looked back at my posts for the offensive phrase, and I only used it once. It is a rhetorical device to assert that I used it over and over again. It's called "the straw man". "John" is setting up a straw man for me. I will just ignore it for now and say what I want to say. I am defensive, of course, of the very good people on the Board who are doing good work putting the DBG back on a good course. I am only evasive in that there is, as you all seem to know, a legal case going on, and I can't comment beyond saying that it's really just a landlord/tenant dispute and not so dramatic as the rumours are making it out to be. Point of information, Justin Hanna is not the ED, he is the Operations Manager, as he was before the retirement of the former ED. The dues paying Members of the DBG are communicated with regularly by our excellent staff and seem to be happy with the almost tripling of services in the Perth neighbourhood, including for the first time ever, swimming lessons. The TDSB and the TCDSB seem to also be happy with the collaborative model for delivery of services that our staff proposed and implemented....we have access to both school boards' facilities and resources that we never had before. Our staff did this. They had the 'what if' concepts and they went out to make them reality. You'll surely make fun of me for this (but you're really making fun of the staff), we were handed lemons and we are making lemonade. And we plan to keep on with improvements...the Westmoreland renovation means we are thinking about how to use that building 16 hours a day, instead of the mere 4 hours a day it has been used for since the early '60s. The Board and the staff are working hard for the future of the Club and its programs and do not deserve the discredit some people are trying to heap on them.
BLUNTNESS
I am going to be very blunt here because I can see that you do not know the history that the b/g have faced in the last few years.
For us that are familiar with Tony/Nick/Justin/Matteo know what hard work these guys do to run programs and what needs improving.
FYI- A few years ago, a few of us froze our behinds off canvassing door to door, rallying Leons (still have the pictures) in order to stop the former location from kicking the b/g out when the lease expired.
The lease was never negotiated before it expired because your previous Director, allowed this to happen.
The community screamed out that there was a need for a club here.
The media was involved http://www.citytv.com/toronto/citynews/life/family/article/20686--dovercourt-boys-and-girls-club-battles-for-survival
We made so much noise that the previous Exec Director Tony Puopolo got a temporary solution to shut us up and look like the good guy.
I was privy to the temporary solution and the comment I recall was "that it was not affordable long term."
He walked out and left the place in a shambles and yes...
HERE WE ARE TODAY....
Lemons out of lemonade- Yes it is recognized to those that were involved and have previous knowledge of what took place that, the NEW BOARD and staff was dealt a bad card and left to p/u the pieces!
HOWEVER....if you read carefully instead of spending so much time dodging or defending, we are wanting to know, WHAT IS CURRENTLY being done to secure a location for the kids in "our" community?
Still Waiting, 6 Months Later
That is what we have been waiting 6 months for, the truth and the facts. Previous postings said that a letter was to go out the next day about what happened with a community meeting to follow, none of which have happened. This is taxpayers money and we have a right to know what is going on. The air needs to be cleared. Enough already! The finger-pointing is not the issue. The children of this community who are being overlooked, again, are the issue!
Really?
Then why don't you clear the air instead of trying to cast doubt? Why has the DBGC been silent for so long in light of such serious allegations - perhaps because the allegations are correct!
The air is cleared.
The air is cleared.
Worthy of Ruprecht
This behaviour is worthy of our worst politicians. When there is something to cover up they deny, evade, sidestep then hide behind the "legal" BS. You had months to explain before the "legal" case became a convenient excuse. Sorry you're not fooling anyone Vivian or Justin.
No it is not
No it is not.
BG Club Wont Address Issues or Face Community--why?
I think that the Chair of the Board of the Davenport Boys and Girls Club could do better than this for a response (2:13 am?). The club is publicly funded and is answerable to the entire community and the entire community has been waiting for a promised public meeting in our community for 6 months.
The community and its children have been poorly treated and there are many unanswered questions as to how, at the end of the day, 300,000$ dollars plus donated goods and services that should have gone to the children and teenagers of this community was pissed down the drain. How did this happen and who is responsible? Having the the moral courage to face the funders and the community asap would be the role of any Chair of a professional publicly funded organization.
Given the enormity of the money involved, and the lack of transparency, the day that an independent administrator/auditor is appointed to take over the Dovercourt Boys and Girls club to satisfy parents, the community, donors, and taxpayers is drawing closer. That's because the community will demand it.
Dovercourt Boys' and Girls' Club
Hi Scott
You criticized my responding at 2:13 a.m. What you don't know is that I tried to respond around 9 and that a virus was unleashed on my computer when I went on this website and that it took me a few hours to regain control of my computer. I have since had new antivirus controls installed to protect me from damage from your website. And what's your point about me working at 2:13 anyway? I work when I work. I am a volunteer, and I put in about 80 hours a month for free for the Club. There's no time frame for me, if I'm still up, or I get up, and I want to work, I work. What does my working at 2:13 a.m. mean in your world? It seems you think it means something bad.
I afford you no more
I afford you no more credibility as a spokesperson. You did not reveal yourself to me for any proper rebuttal or debate, if that is what you told people you were doing. You wrote things about me that I did not know about until now. You have not behaved honourably.
I afford you no more
I afford you no more credibility as a spokesperson. You did not reveal yourself to me for any proper rebuttal or debate, if that is what you told people you were doing. You wrote things about me that I did not know about until now. You have not behaved honourably.
Chair Should Step Down
In light of what has taken place shouldn't the chair and possibly the entire board of directors step down? When are the kids in this neighbourhood finally going to be thought of? Where is the accountability? Somebody needs to look into this.
I thought about stepping
I thought about stepping down. I thought about being bullied into stepping down and I thought about staying on to do the heavy lifting of the work that needs to be done. For now, I'm staying on and you can vote against me, if you're a Member, at the next Annual General Meeting.
HERE'S A SUGGESTION
WHY don't you spend your energies providing this community with answers.
-What the next plan of action is for the children in this community.
Explain to us what "heavy lifting" you are doing right now instead of spewing a series of empty comments when it is CLEAR that the COMMUNITY is and has been asking for the last 3-4 years this question.
"WHAT IS BEING DONE" to implement a permanent location here in the community for the kids????
Why don't you answer this one or is it a secret?
I don't see much heavy
I don't see much heavy lifting going on. I see heavy avoiding. Heavy lifting is something the community could get behind.
I don't think the B&G can do it on it's own
This same message will be sent to Ana B Councillor and Vivian:
The fight to get some permanent location for the children of this community has been going on for many years more then 3 or 4 yrs that was mentioned. One of the issue is and has been is the lack of support and interest for children programs from our three levels of government or our elected offical. Many of us also believe that Adam G. was more of a problem then a solution with the Leon's/Randolph issue then we want to believe. We have also seen first hand how much he really cared when he tried to take a park away from the Children of Rankin, nearing homes and daycares and others who use the park to make room for a community garden.
Also all the community needs to be informed and to be heard and allowed for their input, we have not heard or seen this yet. So the first step should be for the residents of Ward18/Junction Triangle to be sent a letter either by the Councillors office of DB&G or both in English and also 3 of the top languages spoken in this community. I have spoken to Vivian and Justin couple of times in the last week or so and have asked what is going on, instaed of hearing from from Allen, Joseph, mother of 2, kevin or the same person. Their are a few individuals or a small group in a larger group in JT who think they are speaking on behalf of the community, they don't speak for me and neither do I for anyone else.
Lastly, I personally don't think DB&G can do it on their own without the hel and support of the 3 levels of government and MONEY and the community. I believe the children are in good hands at the B&G and the children don't need to hear or to get involved with the personal issues of the parents. I believe Justin and the team is doing a good job. I also believe Vivian and the board are trying, not prefect and she can't say more then she can at this point, it's before the courts. We know Tony Puopolo lied and wasn't honest to the community the board and the B&G we never had a permit for a children program it was for a Dance Studio for 18 and over not children. We should of never gone to the next step without checking and guess what your BOY B and Adam's Office should of seen it and caught it, heck Kevin B. took the credit during Municipal election for the new Ernest site.
I use a quote from of a few people in the hood that post of the JT website, instead of wasting your energy on something negative, do something positive move forward. JF
disclosure
I'd like to know what is going on as well. Or what did go on, it is important to keep an issue like this alive if there is to be any accountability.
Boys and Girls Club
I have been wondering about this issue for some time. Would the new mayor be happy with the waste of taxpayers' dollars? It has been quiet for too long. We all deserve an answer to what is going on with the club in this area.
The Villager
Anyone read the recent article in the Villager regarding this issue? They say that the want to accomodate everyone at the Westmoreland location. How is that convenient? How are they going to get the kids from Perth all the way past Dufferin and Wallace? At one point they didn't want to make the kids cross Bloor St. They also said that they had a surplus of funds from the Westmoreland Renos but they can not use that money toward 45 Earnest. Sounds let our kids are going to be left behind in the end.
Our children stay in THEIR
Our children stay in THEIR community. Period.
B&G Club: Toronto Star article
Toronto Star article published online today:
http://www.thestar.com/news/gta/article/864497--west-end-youth-club-aban...
Read the rest of the article on The Star's website.
B&G Club in The Villager / Inside Toronto today
Article is online here:
http://www.insidetoronto.com/news/local/article/873466--new-home-for-boy...
Read the rest at Inside Toronto.
i think it's taking them far
i think it's taking them far too long to provide answers and full disclosure. the rumour mill is already churning and it's only going to make it that much harder for the club to receive future community support/donations/volunteers if they don't answer to the community asap.
Boys and Girls topic
Perhaps this would be a good time to start a new discussion topic. I don't have kids so I can't say much, but a community meeting in say a couple of weeks might be in order. As fun as it is to beat on each other, we might save that wonderful vitriol for a moment. I propose we get as many facts as we can (they may not be forthcoming), come together say Thursday the 23rd, in a park if we must, a better location if we can.
We might conclude that no action would be useful and we could then resume our regular Keystone Cop routine. Or we might have demands that we feel need to be put to the boys and girls club - or someone else if we come up with a more eligible villain. Perhaps we might want to get a couple of buses to their Markham headquarters to make some noise as a gentle suggestion that it would be wise for them to make the Junction Triangle a top priority. It might be nice to focus this wonderful creativity externally for once.
Kids don't matter in this hood
An interesting bit of history. Back in 2007 the Boys and Girls Club (then on Randolph) was threatened with eviction by George Leon of Leon furniture fame. The community fought back and started a "Boycott Leon's" website. It worked. In less than two days after the site was up the director of the B&G club phoned us and asked us to take down the link and logo for the same club that we were fighting to save! Head office (the Boys and girls Cubs of Canada) had put pressure on him (he wouldn't say he was threatened, but he didn't deny it either) to disassociate the club from the community and the website. It turns out the Boys and Girls Club of Canada was "negotiating" with Leons for some kind of donation. I guess they work for corporate sponsors, not for kids. It doesn't surprise me they have left our kids out to hang again. Feel free to contact them and ask why they repeatedly demonstrate contempt for the Junction Triangle children.
Pam Jolliffe
President and CEO
Boys and Girls Clubs of Canada
7100 Woodbine Ave., Suite 204
Markham, Ontario. L3R 5J2
T: 905/477-7272
info@bgccan.com
President of BGC Extension
Pam Jolliffe
President and CEO
Boys and Girls Clubs of Canada
7100 Woodbine Ave., Suite 204
Markham, Ontario. L3R 5J2
T: 905/477-7272 X 226
info@bgccan.com
I have called Pam and asked her to make a public statement on the situation.
BGC National Office Investigating
I talked with Pam Jolliffe, President and CEO, Boys and Girls Clubs of Canada this morning. Obviously she cannot monitor every single club in detail but they are very aware at the national level that there are issues with the Dovercourt Club and the cancellation of the Ernest Club. I agreed in conversation to not at this time provide any details of our talk. The short form version is we discussed the many issues.
The regional BGC manger will be having a meeting within a week with current management and Board Chair to find out what is going on and to get some answers to the many questions swirling around the community. It has also been promised that others from the JT with direct knowledge of the situation will be contacted to shed light on the situation and that the National Office will sty in contact with us as they investigate.
The potential wasting of
The potential wasting of $200,000 minimum is a worthy topic for most taxpayers, especially when that money had been earmarked for children.
How Much will be wasted ?
Why did they keep everybody in the dark and not provide a chance for people in the community to seek solutions and maybe even raise funds?
If they leave that location there will be.
1. The waste of the original funding and donations.
2. The cost of restoring the site to it's original condition which is standard.
3. The legal fees and penalties for breaking the lease.
How much donated money and time are we about to loose here? And on whose shoulders does this fall?
At the August 25, 26 and 27, 2010, Council meeting Council voted to give 35,000 to the Dovercourt Boys and Girls Club on Westmorland for their reno needs. Was there ever any discussion or attempts to get help for JT at that time?
It would be great if the Board of the Dovercourt Boys and Girls Club came clean on what they have been up to and engage the actual community where donated money was spent (and may be wasted).
"Why We Cancelled the Project at 45 Ernest Ave"
Why We Cancelled the Project at 45 Ernest Ave
An Open Letter from Operations Manager Justin Hanna:
Dear members of the Junction Triangle community, on August 24th, 2010, after a careful review of the Ernest project and the long term operations and goals of our organization, our new Board of Directors decided to cancel our quest to build a new centre at 45 Ernest Ave. This was not an easy decision and no one was happy to make it.
I would like to share with you the reasons for this decision and what we intend to do over the coming months to ensure that the long term promise of a permanent home for our newly named Junction Triangle Boys & Girls Club become a true reality. We would like to clearly state though, that while our work at 45 Ernest Ave has ended, our work to provide top notch quality after-school programming and day camps for your community continues. As we write this letter, the senior staff at the Junction Club are busy preparing their programs for the new school year, and are extremely excited to begin a new year with the hundreds of youth they serve. We remain committed to the Junction Triangle community and we are committed to ensuring that every youth who joins our club, is well taken care of and surrounded by great positive role models.
Here is a brief history of events. In April 2010, I took over from retired Executive Director Tony Puopolo. At that time, I began a full review of our organization and a review of our capital projects. I began by asking the question, did these projects make sense for our Club as a whole, did they serve the long term interest of the youth we serve and did they serve the long term interest of the communities we proudly play host to. The project at 45 Ernest Ave was one that was rushed into by the previous administration, one that was never properly evaluated for its site use requirements, effectiveness or economic feasibility. Our organization rushed into a massive capital project without ensuring that all proper steps, including proper zoning, were taken to ensure that our Club could properly operate in this facility. As a result of prior poor planning and judgment, we would have been left with a centre that could never serve the basic function of our organization, let alone the long term programming goals that staff are planning to execute over the coming months.
I realize that a promise was made to all of you, that you would be walking into your new home this year. While I am delaying this promise, please know I intend to keep it. I believe that the community deserves a Club that can help foster the positive changes happening within the Junction Triangle, a centre that you can be proud of and call your home, a centre designed for the 21st century and one that delivers on the types of programs that we as an organization and you as parents demand.
In the next few weeks, senior staff will be meeting to form a working group tasked with compiling an Executive Plan written, designed and published specifically for the Junction Triangle Community. A plan that looks specifically at your community, its demographics , the interest of youths, and other program service deliveries in the area. This plan, with its goal of being completed by spring 2011, will for the first time look at our critical role in the Junction Community.
We rushed into the 45 Ernest Ave project. We refuse to make the same mistake twice. We are going to be a permanent player in the Junction community, we are going to be a long term positive force and we are going to ensure that every youth in the Junction Triangle community has every opportunity that every child deserves in our great city, therefore we are going to start planning for the long term. I make a commitment to you that this process will be done properly and efficiently.
I hope you, as community members and leaders, can understand the difficult decision that we have had to make, and grant us the opportunity as an organization to get it right.
Our staff at the Junction Triangle Boys & Girls Club currently operating out of 120 Perth Ave, are excited to begin a new school year and are committed to providing top notch after school programs.
Finally, we have to acknowledge the tremendous support, assistance, and advice we received from Councillor Adam Giambrone and his staff. Also, we thank the staff and students at Central Technical School, Sears, the GAP, and Home Depot for their valiant attempts to turn a warehouse into a community centre. It is entirely regrettable that all our efforts were in vain.
Thank you
Justin Hanna
Operations Manager
Dovercourt Boys & Girls Club
justin hanna letter - update?
I've just been reading the B&G comments on this site and am getting increasingly confused. One thing that seems clear, though, is that the Club isn't communicating effectively with the members of the Junction Triangle. I've just reread the Justin Hanna letter, from September 2010, to try to get a better understanding of the situation, and it certainly is vague by way of explanation. I still don't quite understand what was wrong with the building on Ernest, after all the work that was put into it. And it's awful to think of all the money, time, and donations going to waste, not to mention the feeling of having something wonderful and long-deserved offered and then snatched away. He does say, though, that "in the next few weeks, senior staff will be meeting to form a working group tasked with compiling an Executive Plan written, designed and published specifically for the Junction Triangle Community. A plan that looks specifically at your community, its demographics , the interest of youths, and other program service deliveries in the area. This plan, with its goal of being completed by spring 2011, will for the first time look at our critical role in the Junction Community." Maybe we could hear from Justin Hanna how the plan is coming?
I agree with Kristen
I think the main problem here is lack of communication from the club. There have been posts from former board members and others previously involved with the club, but no official updates from the club itself. It seems that the longer the information stays hidden, the more vicious the rumours get.
I really do hope that this gets cleared up. Current staff and board members should really post something to explain what happened, and provide a status update, otherwise the situation might just continue to deteriorate.
I've had several people ask me directly* if I know what's happening with the B&G Club, but everything I know is through indirect channels. I don't like spreading rumours or false info, so I usually don't say much. I wish I could point people to a document or press release from the club that explains everything, but right now I can't.
I hope you all can get this sorted out soon. Good luck. And if the club wants me to post some news or other info to this site, like I have in the past, please get in touch.
Cheers,
Vic
* People seem to think I have answers about everything in the 'hood because I run this site. Unfortunately, that's not always the case :)
"Vic" says I haven't posted,
"Vic" says I haven't posted, but I have posted. I have explained things as best I can, several times. There has been no "hidden information". The moderator of this forum should know that I have posted even if "Vic" doesn't know it and the moderator should have corrected "Vic" before allowing Vic's erroneous and abusive post to go up.
I have posted. Several times. Too many times. All I get from posting is more abuse. Everything I post is treated as fodder for more accusations against me, the Board members, and our wonderful staff....none of us who have had anything to do with the creation of this situation which we are doing our level best to solve. We do not deserve the abuse we are receiving.
As stated before, I welcome any investigation. I will participate in any investigation fully and I will welcome the opportunity to finally freely express my own concerns about any purported financial goings-on.
It is 3:50 a.m. Does anyone have a negative comment about that? Oh by the way, Justin has never "blogged" on this website, but Scot D. has quoted him as if he has. Does this make Scot D. a liar? I think so.